• Home
  • News
  • Fortune 500
  • Tech
  • Finance
  • Leadership
  • Lifestyle
  • Rankings
  • Multimedia

Luck vs. skill: What Bill Gross and Bill Miller have in common

By
Lauren Silva Laughlin
Lauren Silva Laughlin
Down Arrow Button Icon
By
Lauren Silva Laughlin
Lauren Silva Laughlin
Down Arrow Button Icon
March 18, 2014, 9:00 AM ET
Bill Gross (left) and Bill Miller (right)

FORTUNE — Pimco’s founder “The Bond King” Bill Gross once quipped that “anyone can theoretically roll 12 sevens in a row.” According to Barron’s in early 2003, he was talking in passing about the then-reigning ruler of stocks, Legg Mason’s Bill Miller, who at the time had beaten the S&P for the previous dozen years.

It was a powerful statement about luck vs. skill from the formidable fixed income guru. Clients might ask if they could apply the same words to Gross, too.

Similar to Miller, Gross has outperformed his peers in the bond market for years. But as the market blinked, Gross’s investments struggled. An ill-timed bet on U.S. Treasuries last year made the Pimco Total Return Fund post a loss. Investors pulled out some $40 billion. Most recently, some internal bickering with former CEO Mohamed El-Erian, aired in unseemly ways through press reports, has raised questions about Gross’ ability to bounce back.

Gross wouldn’t be the first person to draw parallels between hot hand streaks and investment success. Economists often use a coin toss analogy to discuss whether the world’s most sophisticated risk takers are actually good at their trade, or if they’ve simply played the game too few times to tell.

MORE: Dick Parsons and Ronald Lauder bring impact investing to sub-Saharan Africa

“Essentially, the problem with assessing any individual manager is disentangling some luck,” says Brad Barber, the Gallagher Professor of Finance at UC Davis and co-principal investigator for the CalPERS Sustainable Research Initiative. When academics look at coin tosses, “you’ll always get streaks of tails or streaks of heads.” When applying this to investing, “the question is whether this is more or less than you would expect by chance.” Focus on the folks that have streaks, he said, and there is little evidence skill, rather than luck, helps them outperform.

Barber explains the odds like this: With four tosses, the odds of four heads is one in 16. If there are 2,000 mutual funds with 4-year track records, then 125 funds would “beat the market” by chance (one divided by 16 multiplied by 2,000). After 10 years, about two out of 2,000 funds would have 10-year winning streaks by chance. (At the end of last year, there were over 7,500 mutual funds.)

Several studies support Barber’s assertions. An in-depth statistical analysis from the University of Chicago in 2010 found that few managers have enough skill to simply cover their costs. A 2009 study from several professors including Scott Stewart of Boston University found that institutional investors lost some $170 billion for clients between 1984 and 2007 because of bad decisions. “Much like individual investors, who seem to switch mutual funds at the wrong time, institutional investors do not appear to create value from their investment decisions,” the study said.

Michael Mauboussin, former strategist for Legg Mason and current head of global financial strategies at Credit Suisse (CS), disagrees. Mauboussin has written several books trying to explain the difference between skill and luck — particularly as it pertains to the few superstar managers. He says that if you can’t lose on purpose, then you can’t win on purpose either. A more appropriate comparison is basketball or other games that require both skill and luck. Poor players could statistically speaking experience winning streaks (think Jeremy Lin’s performance in 2012 with the Knicks), but consistent streaks by a handful of performers suggest that skill is involved (Wilt Chamberlain).

MORE: You can’t judge Business Insider’s value by its investors

In his book More Than You Know: Finding Financial Wisdom in Unconventional Places, Mauboussin writes, “We can only hope that Gross, who has a great investment track record and familiarity with gambling, was misquoted: The odds of rolling twelve sevens in a row are approximately 1 in 2.2 billion.”

A few years after Gross’ comments, Miller’s hot hand went cold. He beat the market for 15 years, but starting in 2006, he grossly underperformed. In 2012, he stepped down from his main fund and took a lesser role at Legg Mason. This spring, he will start to manage a fund with his son. With only one shaky year, Gross still reigns in bonds. Only time will tell if his fortunes have been the product of a lucky streak or if they are representative of real skill.

About the Author
By Lauren Silva Laughlin
See full bioRight Arrow Button Icon

Latest in

CryptoBinance
Binance has been proudly nomadic for years. A new announcement suggests it’s finally chosen a headquarters
By Ben WeissDecember 7, 2025
3 hours ago
Big TechStreaming
Trump warns Netflix-Warner deal may pose antitrust ‘problem’
By Hadriana Lowenkron, Se Young Lee and BloombergDecember 7, 2025
7 hours ago
Big TechOpenAI
OpenAI goes from stock market savior to burden as AI risks mount
By Ryan Vlastelica and BloombergDecember 7, 2025
7 hours ago
InvestingStock
What bubble? Asset managers in risk-on mode stick with stocks
By Julien Ponthus, Natalia Kniazhevich, Abhishek Vishnoi and BloombergDecember 7, 2025
7 hours ago
EconomyTariffs and trade
Macron warns EU may hit China with tariffs over trade surplus
By James Regan and BloombergDecember 7, 2025
7 hours ago
EconomyTariffs and trade
U.S. trade chief says China has complied with terms of trade deals
By Hadriana Lowenkron and BloombergDecember 7, 2025
8 hours ago

Most Popular

placeholder alt text
Real Estate
The 'Great Housing Reset' is coming: Income growth will outpace home-price growth in 2026, Redfin forecasts
By Nino PaoliDecember 6, 2025
2 days ago
placeholder alt text
AI
Nvidia CEO says data centers take about 3 years to construct in the U.S., while in China 'they can build a hospital in a weekend'
By Nino PaoliDecember 6, 2025
2 days ago
placeholder alt text
Economy
The most likely solution to the U.S. debt crisis is severe austerity triggered by a fiscal calamity, former White House economic adviser says
By Jason MaDecember 6, 2025
1 day ago
placeholder alt text
Economy
JPMorgan CEO Jamie Dimon says Europe has a 'real problem’
By Katherine Chiglinsky and BloombergDecember 6, 2025
1 day ago
placeholder alt text
Big Tech
Mark Zuckerberg rebranded Facebook for the metaverse. Four years and $70 billion in losses later, he’s moving on
By Eva RoytburgDecember 5, 2025
3 days ago
placeholder alt text
Politics
Supreme Court to reconsider a 90-year-old unanimous ruling that limits presidential power on removing heads of independent agencies
By Mark Sherman and The Associated PressDecember 7, 2025
15 hours ago
Rankings
  • 100 Best Companies
  • Fortune 500
  • Global 500
  • Fortune 500 Europe
  • Most Powerful Women
  • Future 50
  • World’s Most Admired Companies
  • See All Rankings
Sections
  • Finance
  • Leadership
  • Success
  • Tech
  • Asia
  • Europe
  • Environment
  • Fortune Crypto
  • Health
  • Retail
  • Lifestyle
  • Politics
  • Newsletters
  • Magazine
  • Features
  • Commentary
  • Mpw
  • CEO Initiative
  • Conferences
  • Personal Finance
  • Education
Customer Support
  • Frequently Asked Questions
  • Customer Service Portal
  • Privacy Policy
  • Terms Of Use
  • Single Issues For Purchase
  • International Print
Commercial Services
  • Advertising
  • Fortune Brand Studio
  • Fortune Analytics
  • Fortune Conferences
  • Business Development
About Us
  • About Us
  • Editorial Calendar
  • Press Center
  • Work At Fortune
  • Diversity And Inclusion
  • Terms And Conditions
  • Site Map

© 2025 Fortune Media IP Limited. All Rights Reserved. Use of this site constitutes acceptance of our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy | CA Notice at Collection and Privacy Notice | Do Not Sell/Share My Personal Information
FORTUNE is a trademark of Fortune Media IP Limited, registered in the U.S. and other countries. FORTUNE may receive compensation for some links to products and services on this website. Offers may be subject to change without notice.