Ann-Marie Campbell, Executive Vice President, U.S. Stores, The Home Depot
Judith McKenna, President and CEO, Walmart International
Moderator: Beth Kowitt, FORTUNE

MPW Summit 2020: Their Workforces Led The Way

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Their companies thrived through the height of COVID. Hear from the two retail leaders on supporting their armies of essential workers and how the pandemic is set to remake the retail world forever.


Hi. I'm fortunate. Senior editor and M. P. W. Co Chair Beth Cohen. What would we have done without the essential workers on the front lines during the height of the pandemic? Among them the legions of retail employees who kept us fed supplies and fulfilled our overwhelming desires to do at home renovation projects during lockdown. Joining me now are two women who helped lead those workers through some of the most difficult days of the crisis. Emory Campbell, executive vice president of U. S. Stores, the Home Depot and Judith McKenna, president and Ceo of WAlmart International. Thank you both so much for joining me. Um Emery, I would like to start with you. You run a more than $100 billion business. But you started out at Home Depot 35 years ago as a cashier. Tell us a little bit about how that experience has informed some of the decisions you've made for your workers during the pandemic. Now thank you and thank you for having me as well. And I want to thank you know, just the hard work in committed associates that are on the front line. I would say that the first thing I would say bad is that we were guided by a couple of priorities. # one, the health and well being of our associates and number two to your point, given our stores opened for the essential needs of our customers. And I remember when I was an hourly associates, what was important is that consistent paycheck was very, very important. And because of that we wanted to guarantee or hours for, or front line associates. So the first thing we did what, whatever scheduled hours that they had and we have consistent schedule, we would pay them for that. That's number one. So consistent schedule gives consistent paycheck. And no matter what our sales would be, we wanted to make sure we guarantee that for Associates number two, the health and well being. Um, we then said to ourselves, we knew that if an hourly associate was sick, right, more than likely they would come to work because they needed those hours. So we, you know, engineered or PTO or uh, personal time off. And we had, we gave our associates 80 hours full time Associates of course, 40 hours for part time, up to 240 hours for at risk or high risk Associates. That means they could stay home if they felt ill or if they had a family member that was ill. So those were the two guiding principles for us to make sure that we drove some consistent paycheck and reduce the anxiety level of our associates. And did you have, um, did you have a lot of, did you have a lot of workers utilize the benefits? I mean, is that something that you found to be effective? It was very effective. And one of the things we were very liberal with that policy to, we, if you didn't feel to come in today because you had a child that probably was sick as you know, people are working from home, kids were at home at that time, an elderly parent, um, or you didn't feel while yourself, we wanted to make sure that you stayed home if you need at that time. So there was just a phone call to the store and said, hey, I won't be able to come in today and people were able to exercise that. Of course, there were some that used it more than others based on their family situation. But absolutely they associate love the flexibility. And the one thing I would point out as well if they did not use the hours, they would get paid out at the end of the year. So we also incented them as well that if they needed to use it, use it, if you didn't, then you'll get a that paid out at the end of the year. Got it. Okay, so Judith you as head of walmart International, got a really early glimpse of what was to come uh since china falls under your purview. Tell us a little bit about when you had a sense that the virus would not be contained, that this was something that was going to be global. Yeah, first of all, it's a pleasure to be here. I'm a really great to hear a lot of the work that you guys were doing through this and an echo those principles deeply for us as well. But yeah, china gave us a window to the world. But I can't say it's probably until into february where we really started to see the the impact that could happen. China business started to say there were some concerns in about the december and by um kind of january they'd gone into lockdown, our president. There are ceo at the time I started to put playbooks together about what to do and you know the things they were doing, they were scrambling because nobody else had faced anything like this. And I remember beth in early february I had all of the other Ceos from around our world. We we operate across 10 primary countries outside of the U. S. 26 in total. Together in boston for a learning session on various things that with Harvard University and we organized for you in uh Ceo to do a two hour zoom session with the teams talking through exactly what had happened and what it might look like. Everybody went into that saying, oh yeah, okay. Why he was spending two hours on this by the time everybody came out of it. I think the dawn of realization about just how significant this could be really struck. And one of the things we did is we shared that best practice as fast as we could adapted by market really was thoughtful about making sure that people could communicate with each other really fast and developed a lot of the policies. We had many of the things that the china team had started with. But this thing that went in different places, in different places, a bit like Amory, you'll have been facing in different states, um, across the US as well. So we had to adapt as we go and learn as we go. And I think one of the things that retail industry also did is we shared with each other. So this, you know, the things that people were doing to keep people safe was not privileged information. This was like, how can we share, how can we share best practice? And that was also a really important after. But early february for me was the big warning sign. So can you tell us a little bit about some of the things that you that you saw in china that you did implement? Um, globally? Where are there lessons, what are some of the lessons that you took from that that you were able to apply to other markets? Yeah. So there's a couple of different things that you understand. One is what the demand patterns are going to look like, so what are people going to buy, what's going to be important to them? So there's a project side to this, the right Omni channel and getting ready in front foot to be able to serve more customers across e commerce where the pick from stores or fulfillment centers and how are you both going to allow people to pick up and also take delivery as well? We more than doubled our operations in many places around the world. What are the best kind of face mask to use? How would you put flexi, glass and plexiglass in front of cashiers and pharmacy? So a lot of very specific detailed things, but also how to communicate. What is the best way to communicate fast if there's an instant self covid in a stall, what do you do? What should be the right cleaning protocols? How does that look? So the list is endless. But everything from the products that you have on the shelves that you need more of through to, how do you communicate through to their practicalities? Those playbooks that come into effect every day. And now we're learning a bit more from them as well as their further through this than probably any of the other markets in which we operate. Yeah, but I was thank do that too for that because we learned a lot from walmart because of that. There was a lot of sharing going back and forth. And uh we implemented a lot of things and ideas just based on the retail sharing. Um So I just want to thank you and your team for that as well. They did a fabulous job. We appreciate it both ways to Yeah dude, if you mentioned the place, you know you mentioned the playbook. I think one thing is that we've seen models and metrics that have historically been used by companies, but I probably both of yours just don't hold any more. Um, and emery, I'm curious for Home Depot. What are there some sort of deep seated beliefs uh, that you had to throw out the window that you thought just couldn't, couldn't change and, and Covid has totally disrupted. Yeah, I'm going to give you more one of a kind of a strategic interdependence perspective and just one just, you know, an experience in the stores. First of all, we have managed this business from an operating business units with your P. N. L. S. And you know, or sales totally align. We have to be fully channel agnostic at this point across the board. Uh, due to spoke about this interconnected Omni channel experience. You can't man manage or measure your business. Just thinking about the stores or thinking about online or thinking about marketing separate or supply chain. It is so interconnected and one influences the other. And so we had to thrill all of that out and we've been throwing that out and we keep on picking up the papers because we want to stick to that so much. But I think that has been really important. The acceleration of understanding interdependence. That's number one. Number two, I would say. Just from your perspective over time, you know, we have added, I would say some complexity to the stores, um because we wanted to drive consistent operations and whether we talk about store business, store walks or, you know, business walks. What we found through Covid is that if you set the guard rails, set the expectation, you don't need 30 metrics to kind of measure output and performance. You need some key inputs to drive great outputs and you let your local leadership do their jobs. And I will tell you that that has reinvigorated or stores because they know what the expectations are and their engineering the outcomes in the right way. Without all the oversight and metrics that they typically would see on a weekly basis. So one uh, from our store support center and the other from what we see in the stores to death. I'd love to hear the walmart perspective on that too. Yeah, maybe just a personal one as well. You know what, what beliefs went out of the window? Probably that there would be a if anything like this ever happened, there would be a unified view of things like what went to wear masks and what masks and what that looks like and all of those things. So, a belief that that would happen was one of the things that went out of the window really quickly and we all realized we were actually kind of writing the script as we went along with the best advice that we could possibly get. But it's really interesting listening to a marine, you know, probably the, it's not a belief that went out the window, but something that's been truly amplified is this concept of the right people make the hugest of differences. So for me it's just not just at the store level but at a country level, having the right leadership teams who can make the right decision at the right time with minimal guidance and frameworks that cover the principles of what you do, but really truly empower them to get on and make the decisions they need to make. That's right for the market in which they operate, whether that be South Africa or India or chile or Argentina, everyone is different. So that belief in that and I'm smiling as I'm already talking because you know that the real skill for all of us going forward will be, can we hang on to the things that are really good And move on from it so that 30 metrics that we all love or whatever the equivalent is learning how to operate and take the best of this will be one of the things that I truly hope is a positive outcome in what is undoubtedly a really difficult situation. Let me ask, let me ask a little bit more about that because memory for you. I mean, how do you see this? The environment is changing retail going forward. You know what is what is a blip that's happening because of this particular moment and what do you think will be long lasting? I mean, you mentioned both of you talked about Omni Channel, but there are other, there are other things. The way you operated the companies, the consumer dynamic, what, what's going to be different? Yeah. So a few years back as a company, we thought this interconnected Omni Channel was going to be, of course, the way we operated in retail And uh, Kobe has accelerated that. And so when we talked, you know, three years ago about investing $10 billion dollars in the business to make sure it was interconnected. We probably were looking a little bit further out. Absolutely. The acceleration around interconnected curbside touch less in the environment where we operate in is just uh, in the now that's number one. But one of the interesting things we're finding as well is people's adaptability. Uh, we were challenged when we do a lot of workshops. We do kids workshop and we do do it yourself workshops within our company. And typically those would happen in our stores, Right? And we try to, you know, push this virtual kind of learning from a workshop perspective. And to be honest, we didn't get it off as well as we wanted to write because guess what it was, what we were doing every single day and it was successful. And so people are learning remotely and they're learning how to adapt remotely, and they're learning how to really leverage others as well to get to be more knowledgeable about the subjects that they're interested. That's number one, number two, they're just more conscious about, you know, when they're purchasing and they're willing to do substitution. So they're doing a lot more research before buying and there, you know, if there's a brand that you don't have, uh they're willing to substitute. So that has implications around assortment and how you narrow the assortment to kind of drive some more simplicity and, uh, you know, consumer satisfaction. So those are some of the things that we think is going to stay, of course acceleration with the interconnected world, but substitution and some of the virtual learning practices that we're seeing today. Great, Great. Um, so we have my colleague Kristen Bell storm joining us here with some questions from the audience. Kristen. Go ahead, please. Hi, this is a great conversation and strumming up tons of questions in the chat. Okay. You know, the first one, we don't have Kristen's audio. So I will continue asking my own question. Sorry, audience. Um, so actually this is a great opportunity Judith I wanted to ask you, you know, we're all tracking Walmart, um, interest in Tiktok right now, which is a big play in social commerce. And can you tell us a little bit about how this fits into your future vision of what retail looks like? You know, next year, five years, 10 years from now? What, where does this fit in? Yeah. So I can't really talk about Tiktok as you would expect. But I think the future of retail is really exciting and I think it is morphing and changing all the time. And you know, we saw trends in aecom omni accelerating two or three years ahead of where we thought things, what happened from Costa rica through to the U. S. To Mexico? I mean, it's been extraordinarily to watch it and the teams have stood up capabilities and moved with the speed. I didn't even know was was possible. So that's phenomenal. But I think the future is going to be interesting. The trend of customers choosing more flexible ways to shop whether they want to shop in store, to look to browse to choose whether they shop online if they have it delivered, if they actually comes to them by a pickup. So, so I think the actual shopping experience will change, but I think there are more interesting things happening as well. You know, firstly, um what's the difference between search to buy a product online and recommendation to buy a product online? And I think, you know, one things we see in china and a good business would be an example of this would be pinned dodo doping do do, which is, you know, they actually are purely by recommendation, not by search. So I think companies will learn to find ways to interact with the customer with kind of interactive commerce going forward as well. Now, what exactly that looks like, I can't tell you today, but one of the great things about this journey has been is that we've learned how to flex innovate and change along every step of it. Right, Okay. I think are we here? She is. Okay. Let's try again. Hi Kristen. Hi, apologies for the technical difficulties. We knew that was gonna happen at some point. Um, you guys are having a great conversation. We have a ton of questions in the chat. The 1st 1 is Jean case and she's asking, I believe this one's for Amory, did you have to deal with any resentment, um, from teams that some took advantage of the benefits of believe while others did not. No surprisingly, I will tell you that everyone was very receptive because the way how we staggered or state the benefits were if you, you know, you got 80 hours, everyone who received 80 hours. But if you were 65 year old or in the at risk community, you got more people understood that. And because of the fact that we indicated that we would pay out at the end. Uh, if it wasn't utilized, people were very happy about that As you would expect. The more high risk you were, the more of the benefits you probably utilized, but absolutely zero resentment in the stores. Uh, and as I said, we made it pretty easy for them to indicate whether or not, you know, they were at a high risk. They just had to submit. I have this condition and you receive the benefit. Great. I have another one. Um, this one's from Stacy, juniac, uh, it is to both of you. What changes undertaken do you see continuing in a post covid world? Yes, I think they undoubtedly, that shopping behavior that you've heard us both talk about for retailers is going to happen. I think people are going to be more interested in health and wellness than they have ever been interested in before. I think we'll sing a worldwide trust will become even more important for us to the products you buy, where you buy them and what that what that means. So I think, you know, outside of the pure retail experience, I think there is a whole new set of behaviors that we're all going to have to focus on in the future and serve people differently as they go through those. We all talk about this online offline and I think that is going to change. But I think there is more than that as well and we need to think about what's important to people and how we, as retailers translate that into services and goods that actually irrelevant for their lives in future. Yeah. And they will continue to add, it's the health and well being. I don't think that's going away. We hear that in our stores, uh, the things that we have done, uh, to just create a safer environment. They want us to continue to do that. And we're just going to continue to invest in areas that we think that their environment, we've got to make the the environment safe for customers and our associates. And I don't think that's going to change. That's just going to continue to be a part of how we manage and lead our teams emery Judith. Thank you both so much for joining us, joining us. Really appreciate the time. Thank you.